In this episode of The Sunny Ray Show, host Sunny Ray talks with Ruud Wolf, a Netherlands based fintech entrepreneur and founder of Liquid, a tokenization and corporate actions platform built to help small and medium sized enterprises raise capital without banks or venture capital. Wolf explains how Liquid lets entrepreneurs issue shares directly to investors, automating compliance and KYC to bring IPO like benefits, lower cost of capital, higher company valuation, and locked in customer and supplier loyalty, to SMEs. He traces his path from a small village childhood in Brabant watching his parents run a retail business, through a corporate career that included a senior vice president role at Visa Europe and work building the Dutch iDEAL payments system, to becoming an entrepreneur seeking more freedom. Wolf also discusses how boxing since age fifteen shaped his resilience and mindset. The conversation covers tokenization's promise and risks compared to the securitization that fueled the 2008 financial crisis, and why public blockchains and transparency matter as tokenization of real world assets accelerates.
A Visa veteran turned boxer and fintech founder explains how tokenizing SME shares can replace bank loans with IPO like power.
Can you share a couple lines about what you're working on today?
I come from a tech and finance background and saw a gap in financing for small and medium sized enterprises, since banks struggle to lend below 500,000 euros without heavy bureaucracy. We built Liquid, a tokenization and corporate actions platform where entrepreneurs set up an investment offer, and investors buy shares or loans in a low cost, compliant, fully automated way, without needing a bank or VC.
What was it like growing up in an entrepreneurial family in a small village in Brabant?
It was a great, carefree childhood without social media, biking to friends and playing in the forest. My parents ran retail fashion stores, and I worked in them, seeing logistics and financials firsthand. They experienced employee theft, economic downturns, and eventually bankruptcy. Watching that actually pushed me away from entrepreneurship at first, and I joined large corporations instead.
How did training in boxing since age fifteen build your confidence and resilience?
A healthy body supports a healthy mind, and both boxing and rugby taught me to face fear before a match and realize things are easier than they seem in your head. My longtime trainer taught me it is not about how often you go down but how often you get up. That mindset applies to life, staying resilient and positive when things get tough.
What was missing from corporate life at Visa that made you want to leave and build something new?
I had an illusion that moving up the corporate ladder would bring more freedom, but it actually brought more rules and less control over my own agenda. I craved creative time, even just one day a week, to work on ideas, which corporate life never allowed. I realized that no matter how high up you go, you're just a number to the company.
You've said you've been passionate about money for over forty years. What do you mean by that?
It started young when my parents got the first PIN terminals in their store around 1983. I later became a payments programmer by accident and realized a pattern connecting my life to money and payment mechanisms. I discovered most money is created by commercial banks through mortgages, not central banks, and that the system often takes disproportionate value from consumers and small businesses.
How does tokenizing a company's shares change the game for entrepreneurs who don't want bank loans?
A mortgage loan can cost nearly double what you borrowed over twenty years, plus heavy paperwork. Large companies get benefits from IPOs like lower debt, higher valuation, and liquidity, so we asked what if SMEs could get the same advantages. Liquid lets companies issue shares directly to investors, customers, suppliers, or staff, raising capital while locking in loyalty, without the multimillion dollar cost of a public listing.
Where can people learn more about you and about Liquid?
I'm on LinkedIn, so people can contact me there, and I also have a website at ruudwolf.com where messages reach me within a day or two. Liquid's website is liqwith.io, though I'll warn people it's currently quite technical since we're planning a full rebrand before summer. We work with European companies now and are exploring expansion into the US, where regulation differs.
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